Conversations with Steven R. Rochlin

Date: Thu, 10 Apr 1997 18:10:09 -0400
From: "Steven R. Rochlin" 
To: zmax 
Subject: Re: Which is Most Musical: Alpine Head Unit vs. Denon, Nakamichi, Kenwood

David,

> Hi. Im looking at the Alpine cass/tuner head unit and getting a
> cd trunk unit. There is the 7548 and 7554.
> The only real diff I see is the amp output of 2 vs 4 volts.

      Couldn't find any info about these specific model numbers in my
new reference books but let's take things at face value here.

 
> The stereo store guy says that the 4 volts gives cleaner sound
> and less distortion when hooking up an amp.
> But he said then you can only use an amp which has
> or rather accepts 4 volts. IS that true?
> Does this 2 vs 4 volt thing really matter?
> One guy thinks its marketing. They could just as easily
> make them all 2 volts but then they can charge more money.

     IF you are going to add an outboard amplifier (which you are) the
extra voltage output gives you:

A) Better 'headroom' for a cleaner output

B) A stronger output to help keep noise out of the system

c) It also probably has a better output stage for cleaner sound


> The sales guy said that Alpine patented 4 volts.

      Yawn.  Maybe so but many other manufactures have 4 volt output
units.  So it's not exclusive.  Still, i'd prefer the 4v versus the 2v
output unit all else being equal.

 
> What about Eclipse? Their cass head put out 1.5 volts.

     (Said like the robot in the TV series "Lost In Space)  "DANGER WILL
ROBINSON, DANGER!"  My humble apologies BUT i highly dislike the sound
of the new Eclipse models.  Just my 2 cents.

 
> At least the ones Im looking at. Im looking at midrange stuff.
> Not high and not low. I dont have the $ for high end.

     Please, pretty please seek out the Sony ES stuff.  They are priced
about the same as the Alpine unit and to my ears sound better. 
Personally, i'd rather have a 2 volt Sony ES over an Alpine 4 volt. 
Please keep in mind the above stuff is only my humble opinion.  
 
> Thanks!

     ALWAYS glad to be of service.  HEY, i just got back from the Mobile
Electronics Show.  i have quite a bit of it on my www site.  No real
news pertaining to head units but there are quite a few install's
featured.

      Again, IF you go Alpine please get the 4 volt unit.  Take care my
friend and if i an be of further service to you please feel free to let
me know.  Take care and as always...

     Enjoy the music,

     Steven

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                 http://top.monad.net/~enjoythemusic/


Date: Sun, 13 Apr 1997 23:11:37 -0400
From: "Steven R. Rochlin" 
To: zmax 
Subject: Re: Which is Most Musical: Alpine Head Unit vs. Denon, Nakamichi, Kenwood

David,

> Are you saying the Sony ES cd is multibit whereas the Alpine
> cd is one bit?

     Not 100% of their new line, though from what i've heard they sound
very good.  Good sound is what matters to me the most.


> They say that the Alpine cd changer is the best and faster one
> but it only works with Alpine heads.

     Faster isn't always better... as you know.  The Alpine is ok, but
again i prefer the Sony ES.  If you NEED a changer and are willing to
spend major $$$ then the Nakamichi may be in order.

 
> What about it (ES vs Alp) sounds better? Better overall range of sound?

    Alpine...  UNLESS you go for the Eclipse outboard multi-bit DAC
which is just ok, but not better then the McIntosh single CD head unit
in my humble opinion.

> Ill give you an example. Are you familier with CAmbridge Soundworks?

    Yes.  In fact i have met Henry Kloss and i live only 2 hours from
Boston.  


> They have awesome speakers. My friend was test listening to the
> Ensemble I and II. The I only had (if I recall the brand names right)
> high and low sound. Something was missing in the mid.
> The II sounded much better. They had wonderful midrange sound that
> made up for the missing quality.
> Now am I talking about difference you can hear with speakers only
> or does this apply to the head units?

    As i posted in rec.audio.car, it's a 'system approach'.  IF you have
an overly bright head unit but recessed highs speakers things *may*
equal out per se.

> Yea. Ill give the ES a listen this weekend.

    And?  How was it?  Just wondering. Take care and best wishes.

     Enjoy the music,

     Steven

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                 http://top.monad.net/~enjoythemusic/


Date: Tue, 15 Apr 1997 12:30:41 -0400
From: "Steven R. Rochlin" 
Reply-To: enjoythemusic@top.monad.net
To: zmax 
Subject: Re: Which is Most Musical: Alpine Head Unit vs. Denon, Nakamichi, Kenwood

dAVID,

> Does that characterize Alpine? Overly bright? Sort of. I mention
> this later.

   Alpines are slightly bright but not overly.  What REALLY matters to
me is that the new Alpines don't seem as, well, musical and smooth (yet
still detailed) as the Sony ES or the McIntosh units to my ears.


> I went to Tweeter last night 
>and they had some ES left but they are getting
> rid of them in favor of selling more Alpine. As a result they are
> selling them cheap. I listened to one, the C500 and it sounded
> good. The thing is, some of the ES head have removeable faces
> and some dont. The C500 doesnt but the RK100 or whatever does.
> I want to find a place that sells both so I can listen to ALpine and
> ES side by side.

 That's hard to find a dealr that had BOTH Alpine and Sony ES :-{(+.


> The XK-R100 is more in my price range. The specs say it has a laseramorfous
> head vs the permalloy head. IS there really a diff in those?

     My humble apologies, i got outta analog cassette tape format a
while ago.  Had a nice studio deck at home years ago and it used
glass-something-or-other heads (not found in consumer decks).  If my
brain serves me well the laseramorfous is DEFINATELY better then
permally.

 
> It seems the R100 is like Alpine with a 30 or 35wx4 and 4 volt preout.
> 
> The salespeople at Tweeter and other places dont seem to know much.

    LOL!!!  Sorry and all.  (Humbly said my friend) i used to work
retail for about 13 years an i'd get customers who actually pay a bit
more just because i KNEW what i was talking about.  Sad, but true.


> They say stuff but it doesnt sound like they know anything esp
> when I ask questions. Ill have to do more research to know whats going
> on. Like when I bought a car last year I found that I knew more about
> cars and the brand a dealer was selling than the saledrone did
> himself. Its pitiful!

   Agreed, but what can you expect when a company only pays slightly
above minimum wage and hires 'warm bodies' at times  :-{(+ .  Dudes like
me get too expensive to keep around UNLESS we insist on working on
commission (which is how i ALWAYS work nowadays).


> The salesguy at Tweeter demo'd an Alpine 7554 last night
> and then put it thru an Alpine 25x4 amp and then a 50x4
> amp. In the particular speakers he was running thru there was a little
> distortion in the 25x4 and then it cleared up in the 50w amp.
> I asked why and he replied cause it was doing more of what it
> wanted to do. Does that make any sense? Sheesh!

    LOL!!!  What about better amplifier amperage?  What about better
power supplies in the amp vs the head unit, etc., etc., etc.


> All I know is my friend had an Alpine head and a HottSetup 25x4
> amp and it sounded good. I think its simply a question
> of matching the speakers with the amp to get good sound.

     YES!  As i stated earlier, SYSTEM MATCHING is very important. 
Unfortunately it seems few know this 'art' in car OR home music
reproduction :-{(+ .


> I dont think I want a 50w amp in my car and I dont think
> its gonna sound as good in the confines of the car as it does
> in the store. 

     It's a 50/50 there.  Remember that when you drive you have ground
noise (higher ground floor noise) to overcome.


> Anyway, I dont know if its me or what but it sounds to me like
> the Alpine sound is more digital that is clean but in a sanitized,
> cold sort of way.

    Agreed.


> As opposed to a warm, mellow, full range sort
> of sound. Ill have to keep doign test listens for a bit to see.

      Again, and i feel like when my Audio Note silver wired Io-2 needle
skips, please listen to the Sony ES and if ya like it, but it.  And NO,
i DO NOT work for Sony.  Actually i'm my own boss... my boss works me
TOO HARD, keeps me up late at nights and he even won't give me holidays
off!!!  (Said with humor) THE GUYS A SLAVEDRIVER!!!!

> Thanks.

      ALWAYS glad to be of service.  Just trying to help out where.when
i can.  i've seen too many people get junk or 'sold' by some sinister
salesperson what they don't want.  If you only knew what happens when i
walk into electronics stores and hear the BS.  Sometimes i want to take
the customer by the hand, prove the salesperson wrong mulitple time, and
then show them what they want, NOT what the salesperson want to sell
(does that make sense?).  Ya see, what REALLY matters to me is that
YOU...

     Enjoy the music (Opus 3 vinyl recording called 'Dynamics" right
now.  It's harpsichord right now, it was pipe organ music earlier),

      Steven
 
Free stuff, recommended recordings, tweaks, articles and much more...

                 http://top.monad.net/~enjoythemusic/

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